Hooniverse Asks- What’s The Oldest Car You’d Seriously Consider as a Daily Driver?
Unless you read this site for the boobies – and if so, you must be woefully disappointed – you’re here for the cars. Fast cars, exotic cars, carbon fiber cars, hand-built cars, Italian cars, historic cars, Shelby cars, racing cars, I’ve-never-seen-one-of-those-before-in-my-life cars. You’re here for basically everything that you jones about but may never get to plant your ass in other than when the owner isn’t looking at a car show, or in 30 years when it’s sitting in the Logan’s Run Pick-A-Part. Aspirations are good, but that also means that you need to have something to get you from point A to point Bar today, so how old is too old to do that without worry?
Take a look around you on the street. When was the last time you saw a car or truck that had sealed beam headlights? I don’t mean that cheap-ass Cable Company Econoline that’s perennially parked in front of the stewardess’ condo, I mean something you or I’d buy. You know when the first official modern composite lamp car was sold in the U.S.? That was the 1984 Lincoln Continental MK VII, and Ford designed that car so it would take a set of rectangular sealed beams in case the feds didn’t approve their petition to allow the multi-part lamps. Today, it’s hard to remember when cars had those big, flat peepers staring out the front, but it wasn’t all that long ago. Still, the majority of cars on the road today are younger than that.
So the question arises- how old is too old? Would you count on getting to work in a car that Ozzy Nelson might have driven? Or is Ozzy Osborn your cut off for reliable transportation? You’ve got to get around, and you count on your daily driver to do so, and that means you need something that isn’t going to leave you stranded with a broken retro-thingy and you wearing some outfit out of Mad Men just to fit in. Not only that but cars from the late eighties back lack both the safety and drivability of more modern iron.
So just how old is too old for a daily driver?
Image sources: [Philippe Boursin, AMCPacer.com]
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1970 Barracuda
<img src="http://chromeplatedclassics.com/chrysler/Plymouth/Plymouth-Barracuda/70-barracuda.jpg">
As far back as one that I can still cheaply put on front disks and a decent over drive. I like my high speed cruising… and stopping.
A lot depends on the make and model. A 1970s Impala wouldn't be hard to use on a daily basis. It's reasonably reliable, easy and cheap to fix, and there are plenty of parts. A 1970s Jaguar XJ on the other hand….
I usually have enough vehicles that "daily driver" is not an exclusive position. So my situation is a bit unusual in that if one car doesn't start I can just jump in another, or into the truck, or on the motorcycle. That said, though, even my new cars are pretty decrepit with age and neglect – at least prior to my purchasing them! So I would consider a 60's car no problem. Much older than that, and the technology is just a little too primitive for daily use. There were a lot of big advances in the 60's cars, with overhead valves, coil springs, disk brakes (or easy conversion to..), etc. You can reliably operate a 60's car with little fiddling beyond the semi-monthly tweaks. I spent years driving a '66 Pontiac as my only car, without ever once being stranded.
That said, more often than not I find myself jumping in my '95 LS400, so I've gotten pretty spoiled by leather, abs, massive disk brakes, and climate control. It makes me feel old some times to realize how coddled I've become.
So perhaps I should buy the '78 Datsun 280Z with the 350 swap that I've been eying. Now that's a daily driver.
I agree with Texan – not so much about age as equipment. For a daily, discs are a must on the front and preferable all the way around. Not that rear drums perform much worse, I just get tired of messing with them. Another necessity – reasonable handling. I can go back to the sixties and find it, but it does tend to whittle down the list.
Mileage and reliability are also priorities in my 60 mile round trip commute. My current daily is a 26 year old Alfa. Despite popular mythology, it delivers on both fronts. I can see going back perhaps another 15 years for a daily but my choices would likely be limited to imports and reasonable candidates here in the heartland are in pretty short supply.
What does your DD look like, I saw one on 435 the other day…
I've twice tried to post a pic here but Hoonibbles is grumpy. It's light yellow ("Avorio') with saddle brown interior and period-correct gold Enke basketweaves.
<img src="http://lh6.ggpht.com/_fVEg3I8ek1A/THGIjkMSR9I/AAAAAAAAAL8/c3CjX3dvKsc/s640/2010-08-22%2015.27.10.jpg"width=500>
I pegged it as an '84 even before doing the math. I love the squishy spoiler (which did carry over to a few '85s).
BTW: lovely car!
Thanks. It looks best in cellphone snaps. It's fun to drive though – so much so that I completely forget about all its cosmetic needs when I'm behind the wheel.
I've nearly talked myself into a Mercedes-Benz W123/124 or a later Volvo 240 on a couple of occasions. I'm not so scared of maintenance costs (though, perhaps I should be) as I am concerned about driving a RWD car in the snow on WV's twisty mountain roads. I'm confident of my abilities in a FWD car, but I haven't driven RWD in the snow in a loooonng time.
Oh, look! It's just the W123 I'd want to buy. A later, fuel-injected, gas-powered 230 sedan for a measly $1800. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Very-Rare-Euro-Spe…
Trying not to sound like the proverbial hippy, the diesel ones really are better. Their parts are still pretty cheap, and the engine design is much simpler than a nearly 30 year old EFI setup. I think the only expensive piece was the actual injector nozzle. The only problems they tend to have is vacuum leaks for all the accessories.
And thanks to their popularity, parts are much more common than their gas counterparts.
Damn hippies! Stop smoking my lawn!
All true. But the gas-powered 4 and 6's go better. Though, as I think about it………wasn't the 2.3 four in late W123's identical to the four that appeared in the original C class?
Turbo. Big, massive, black hole turbo.
"Great driver with the exciidingly rare 4-cylinder option". Cue Iron Maiden and "run to the hills…"
240 / 740 is about good as it gets in the "cheap/reliable/comfortable old car" department. Parts availability is good, parts are reasonably inexpensive and majority of service operations are reasonably easy. Just stick to the 1988 and newer models to avoid the dreaded rotting wiring harness issue.
I remember reading an article (probably in the mid-'80s) making the case that the '68-'72 GM A-body intermediates were something of a pinnacle. Just the right size, simple pre-emissions strangulated engines, plentiful cheap parts and modern enough to be very drivable in modern traffic with reasonable handling and braking. Even more favorable today with lots of repro trim and interiors available.
I think with modern radials, some very mild upgrades to shocks and anti-sway bars and disc brakes, these would still be quite competent. That's about as early as I'd want to go for a DD.
Well, here is your dream car during that era…. http://hooniverse.com/2010/09/17/hooniverse-fastb…
<img src="http://hooniverse.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/IMG_2441-720×338.jpg" width="500" />
Had a '72 Cutlass convertible as a DD for 17 years. Sold it in 2000 and of course regret that. With the disc brakes and spindles from a later model Firebird, new trick coil springs, bushings and bilsteins it handled great. A company named HO Racing used to sell that setup.
I have about a 10 mile commute. Most of it on roads with a speed limit of 45mph or less. So maybe a Model A a Model T would be just too slow. Realistically, I'd like A/C, radial tires, and disc brakes or at least good hydraulic drums so maybe mid-1950s. Daily driver implies rain or shine, hot or cold.
I pulled the plug on my BMW E30 when it reached 19 years old. It still performed as well as the average new car, but various components had reached an age where failures were accompanied by disintegrated fasteners and adjacent parts being revealed as well on their way to self-recycling. The same process happened about 3 times as fast in our E36. Progress.
American cars that I'd be interested in owning come from an age where the best of them all require fuel of a higher quality than is readily available today. I remember C2 Corvettes being popular daily drivers right into the early '90s, but now the nice ones are too valuable, and the high performance engine options really couldn't be used in stock configuration. The same goes for super cars of the era, which are now called muscle cars.
I'd be willing to make a go of using a Mercedes W113 as a daily driver. They have brakes, engines that aren't particularly stressed, and perfomance to compare with modern economy cars. They're also made out of parts that don't have built in expiration dates. I wouldn't really take one over my current modern car, but I could imagine making do.
Honestly for a DD, I wouldn't go over 10 yrs old. I want the reliability/creature comforts/safety of a newer car.
Since I live only 6 miles from work and the top speed is 45, I could drive just about anything back to 1928. And, for one summer, I did drive a '30 Model A. With the windshield cranked out, it wasn't as hot as you'd think. There was plenty of room for hauling stuff in a Tudor. Best of all, the cool girls loved it.
It sort of depends on my commute. If it were for short jaunts around my small town, then there's not much of a limit – I could easily consider back into the 20's (albeit with modifications for livability). On the other hand, with my current commute into the city, I'd rather keep to something within 20 years old or so – between the occasional bit of bumper to bumper traffic, and the Don Valley Parkway in general, I'd like something with reasonably modern turning, stopping, and cooling capabilities.
i'd seriously be okay with anything post WWII……… i can do the every-other day maintenance
or learn to do it… i have a serious love of the late 40s and early 50s shapes… from any manufacturer….. though i do have a serious love of all things studebaker and 48-51 mercury… and well… all the germans from that era and upwards.
this is waaaay too broad of a question for me to answer.
vista cruiser. there. i did it.
Depends on the job. If I am the owner of the company and gettng to work is optional, then something vintage and British. If I am the worker, which I am, then 2000 would be the oldest. Still, it can be rather unique. Just add the safety and creature comforts for everyday getting to work. My '02 Jetta turbo fits this and I like it.
As long as we’re talking around-town driving, a 1930-ish Model A would be nice. I’d probably add hydraulic brakes and hot rod it a bit though.
If I’m going to do any highway driving I’d want airbags, seatbelts, and crumple zones (or a roll cage and racing harness).
I've often thought putting a full roll cage and racing harness in a DD was a good idea, a lot of wacky can happen during a 25 mile commute…
It depends on the car. I would totally rock a 1960s Se7en for daily driver in the summer, with a modernish car for winter duty — preferably with AWD.
Speaking of that AWD, a 5 year old Audi RS4 quattro Avant — while a salacious bit of kit — would scare the bejebus out of me for DD duty. It would be a weekend driver. High strung German hot rods can have issues that would be hard to overcome for a daily driver unless I had a boss as into the car as I am.
The oldest car I have daily driven was an 80 mercury zephyr, when I was in high school six years ago. The nice thing about old cars is their simplicity, only a few wires get the whole thing running.
I could handle an old falcon/nova/dart with a straight six, electronic ignition, and discs up front. Unfortunately one worth driving would also be worth parking for a pennsylvania winter and I do like how efi is ready to go much faster in cold weather.
<img src="http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c73/xgot_monsterx/Falcon/DSCN4914.jpg" width="600">
Did you know Falcons like to play in the snow?
<img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3383/3635714325_09c9a25f12_z.jpg?zz=1" width="640" height="437" alt="64 monte carlo rally ljungfeld ford falcon" />
Its not that it can't see snow, but if it survived 40 years without succumbing to the rust monster I'd like it to last 40 more.
I love old cars for daily drivers! In the mid 90s, that is all I used to drive for daily use. I have had a 68 Ford XL, 69 Chevy Blazer, and for a short time I drove a 60 Chevy Biscayne. Hell, I didn't buy my first new car until 2000. If not for the need of creature comforts, and things like safety belts, I would rock out with something from anywhere from the mid 50s on up through the late sixties any day of the week!
Personally, the oldest car I've used as a DD was about 30 years old at the time. My primary DD today is a '95 model, and throughout the years, most of my daily drivers have been old enough to qualify, based on age, for a driver's license.
A guy who used to work where I do commuted in his 1940(?) Ford F1. It was a stock vehicle in survivor condition, and he drove it rain or shine. I've been seriously considering getting a crusty old truck (no newer than 1966, unless it was something special like a L'il Red Express) as a daily driver for days that don't require A/C or similar creature comforts.
I haven't owned a car newer than 25 years old in at least 4 years. Although that's impressive in my mind, a friend of mine who works at Hagerty Insurance just picked up a 1931 Model A that he will be driving exclusively for a year. It will be his only car. I think they are planning on documenting it on their website.
Back in `05, I daily drove a `71 Cutlass in the summer, and a `84 Delta 88 in the winter (I live in the snow belt where salt is used.) The Cutlass was not really that unbearable as a daily driver, even with its four-wheel drum brakes. Sure, panic stops could be a tad squirrelly, and the two piece seat belts were a pain in the ass, but it was a lot of fun. Lots of compliments. The Delta was very reliable, and quite good on the snow. Since then, I have daily driven my `89 Volvo 240 wagon, which currently has almost 276k on it.
I know it's no great feat, but my 1990 Nissan 240SX (built July 1989) is my everyday driver, including snow filled, central Ontario winters. Not bad for a car that is old enough to drink in the USA.
people are always amazed at what a small car with a good set of snow tires can do….. i have a friend who used to drive his '99 2.5RS (2dr subaru) up and down the hills of (w)lafayette, IN… and i'd follow him easily in my 94 summit 2 dr…. past all kinds of trucks and suvs in the ditch….. also running a 2000 beetle TDi through all kinds of crazy nebraska snow storms… was always fun to see the looks people give you as you fly past them in a "much less capable vehicle"
it's all about knowing how to drive your vehicle!
Anything not carbureted. I've actually never owned a carbureted car.
So something with EFI, decent brakes, and power steering.
I have daily driven my '85 LTD for a few weeks, but that almost doesn't help as nearly every part of the powertrain, suspension, brakes, and steering has been updated to something newer/better.
The carbs before the emissions era were not bad. Personally, I favor Q-Jets, near EFI levels of throttle response.
Yup, that's what i came to say. For me DD means NO CARBS. In Chicago there's going to be roughly a two month stretch where mornings are below 20F, with 14 <10F days mixed in. EFI in just about any state of tune is going to not mind those conditions but carbs are a different story.
I would totally drive a 240Z as I know them relatively well and know where to get parts. I like driving them too. So I guess the answer for me is 1970 240Z. Living in SoCal probably makes driving a really old car around a lot easier.
You get bonus points for actually doing it.
My oldest daily driver is now 73 years old, which means it came with hydraulic brakes (Thanks, Chrysler Corporation!). I admit those are nice, though I wouldn't consider their absence to be a deal-breaker; mechanical brakes are just fine when properly adjusted. The lack of turn signals is entertaining, but one consequence is a difficulty in changing lanes to the right in heavy freeway traffic.
Cops have pulled me over twice: The first one thought my right tail light was burnt out, but no, it never had one (an extra-cost option). The second thought my headlights weren't on, but they were: six-volt incandescents just don't add much to the ambient glow when deployed under street lights.
The car is so very close to stock, but at some point a previous owner did add a heater. It's useful enough in the Pacific Northwest that I've kept it. No defroster, however, even though that was also an option in 1937. Also no radio or sun visors– the original owner bought just about the most stripped-down version available. It is fun watching first-time passengers grope around for seatbelts until eventually realizing there are none.
I don't hesitate to drive it anywhere, on any road (or sometimes no road), at any time of year. It even has a set of vintage Presto tire chains that are much easier to install and remove than modern types, so snow is not much of an issue. Outward visibility suffers somewhat when it's snowing, admittedly, since the car only has a wiper on the driver's side. I seldom have cause to drive it more than 400 miles from home, but that's not due to any concerns I have for the car.
Would I consider something even older than this for a daily driver? Yes, of course I would. I'd keep it off the freeway if it couldn't cruise comfortably at a minimum of 50 mph (the Plymouth will do sixty all day), but other than that I have no restrictions. We have the opportunity to drive these cars; soon they will be found only in museums and soon after that they will simply no longer exist. I'm a geologist, so I take a long-term view of "soon" and "recent." Meanwhile, drive 'em if you've got 'em.
Awesome. What sorts of maintenance parts availability issues do you have with a DD that's nearly three quarters of a century old?
The L-head six was around in one version or another for decades, so routine parts are, um, routine. There's still fair support for essentially all of the mechanical bits and pieces. The rest is variable. Six-volt headlights remain an on-the-shelf item locally, thanks mostly to all the VW owners in Seattle. Unique-to-'37 parts are obviously the hardest, especially when everyone wants the same broken piece. I've been looking for a replacement clip for the hand throttle and a decent windshield crank mechanism for several years now but the car is functional without them. All the glass is flat, so it's easy to have replacements cut as needed.
Overall it's my most reliable car, though perhaps that's not saying much. I've gone for several consecutive months in which it's my only operational vehicle when I've been looking for parts for my non-domestic obscurities. My daily commute is ten miles each way through urban traffic and highly variable weather conditions. Not a problem except for the road ruts; bias-ply tires are unhappy in road ruts.
Clearly, you were mistaken when you've called me the crazier one.
You get bonus points for not only doing it, but with the oldest car in your fleet. In fact, I think I should nominate you for an Outstanding Hoon Award, to be given at the annual Hooniverse Awards Banquet on or before Russian New Year.
Aha! So there ARE prizes…. Orthodox or secular new year?
Early 60s Checker Superba. Sure it sports a drivetrain that comes from an automaker whose engines usually turn my arms yellow (oil). But, there is something to be said about driving a car whose wheels aren't designed to fall off after 100,000 miles.
<img src="http://www.motorbase.com/uploads/pictures.ubh/2007/04/10/fs_61Checker_Superba_Wagon_A.jpg" img="">
And yes, the longroof would be preferred.
Given my current situation of various "modern" cars with an assortment of hard-to-pin-down electrical gremlins, I'm thinking maybe the older the car the better. I'm recalling more fondly of the '72 toyota Corona that my wife and I owned for a time. It was just like looking into the engine bay of a 1960 Chevy but scaled down. Nice crank windows and a "climate control" system that consisted of a single lever. Spartan and dumb simple.
I use my 1985 Cutlass Supreme Brougham as a backup to my 355k mile Nissan truck, but I don't think I could use it as a daily driver. At least as long as I deliver pizza as it uses too much gas and has too many issues. If I had a job that was less than 5 miles from home and didn't require me to drive my own car though, I probably would use the Olds as a daily. So, I guess the answer is that it depends on my actual use. I don't want to run an older car into the ground after doing a lot of work to it. I'd rather do that to something newer that I haven't put my heart and soul in to.
My wife's daily was a '78 W123 280E until 3 weeks ago. It was almost replaced with a '71 250SE, but came into an '89 190E 2.6 stupidly cheap.
I'd certainly daily a Lotus Elite or Hillman IMP, should one arrive.
Though my current lust is for a Maserati Biturbo, my current daily is an Alfa Milano. 2 years ago it was an X1/9 with a XR4ti in the middle.
Not old, but not what most people think of as dailies.
You have balls for wanting to daily drive a Biturbo.
Yes, two of them.
I think it could be done easier than most people think.
Keep living the dream, man! I can't even remember when was the last time I saw a Biturbo that was able to move under it's own power.
I haven't bought a car for personal use yet, mainly because I don't need one so having one would be quite stupid. Still, that doesn't stop me from trolling Craigslist. Looking at pictures, I probably wouldn't consider anything that's at about 20 years old. Mid-80s to early 90's cars, and even late 90s-2000s are starting to have visible rust in my area. I might make an exception to a good example of a car from any year if I like it enough, but then there's the issue of fixing it. I don't have tools, nor do I have a garage. Also, the car might end up being expensive because there's something going.
So yeah, I'm probably looking to buy an interesting reliable newish car, or maybe find a friend willing to teach me maintenance/let me park at his (or her?
) place/lend me tools and have an older car. I want the latter more, of course.
any 50's shoe box
I'd like to DD my 924S, and did for about a month earlier this year (February-March), but it's left me stranded 3 times now, and is absolutely unwilling to start at the moment. My current daily driver is a 1997 Caravan, and while it's not fast or sexy or fun like the Porsche, it starts every day, and that's what matters. As others have said, it depends on the make and model. I wouldn't hesitate to DD an '80s Honda or Toyota, or some old American boat, but I'd definitely hesitate to do it with something old and German, let alone something old and Italian or British.
At 43 years old, it is still a Nissan so it just kept on ticking for years and years. I've had no qualms jumping in it and taking it on 800 mile round trips, or even to BFE 100 miles out in the boonies, 5 miles to the store or 10 miles to work 6 days a week. I turn the key and go. My next newest driver is an MGB that I also take anywhere, any time. Including remote communication sites or way up on mountain-tops.
Would I consider something older? Sure! My only real requirements are "modern" mechanical designs, so no open carriage steam cars with tiller steering. A 57 Ford or Willy's Wagon/Pickup are high on my must-have lists and would meet my needs nicely. So long as it is bulletproof and reliable. A lot of 50's-60's designs were just that, made to last and last. A little maintenance and know how go a LONG way.
When you look at old cars as ancient artifacts or museum treasures, you miss the fact that they were once new vehicles that people trusted to do the job every day. There are only X-amount of mechanical parts you can rebuild before you end up with a functionally new vehicle again. And the older you go, the less cheap crap there is to break.
I'm not knocking new cars. I just prefer the old.
<img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3499/3812725117_a829553547.jpg" />
"…driver is an MGB that I also take anywhere…" blah blah blah "…so long as it is bulletproof and reliable." Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha … gasp … ha ha ha ha ha! Whew. And I believe with that we are now officially back to YOU being the crazy one.
Until I find an open carriage steam car with tiller steering.
I expect to see Mr. Harrell add a 1908 Stanley Steemer to his fleet and write about how he drives it daily. This would not surprise me.
The only hitch is that I'm also a cheapskate. I've yet to spend more than $4500 buying a car (usually far less) and not much more than that on repairs. But if you know of a halfway-decent Stanley in my price range….
Nay nay crazyman. Tis you who are crazy. I just lack sound judgement.
Your points are well taken. My Alfa, while young by your fleet's standards was completely unreliable until I repaired or replaced just about every mechanical system on it. Now it doesn't look as good as it did as a baby but I have no qualms about driving it anywhere.
That is sexy. It almost makes me forget about the 510 on my dream list.
I daily drove(until officially yesterday[btw anybody want to buy my car?]) a 1962 comet. Worked just fine for me. As long as a car has good wiring and relatively new "suspect" parts(ball joints, points etc) then I have no problem driving it. I would consider something even much older with maybe an engine swap. I've even used my comet for the 280 mile trek to college with no problems. Only thing I really worry about on old cars(other than "suspect" parts) are overheating issues. If I'm fine there then lets go!
A 62 Comet? ooOOo… Yes and no to your "Buy my car" question. Yes, I want it. I once had a black 62 Comet wagon, missing the front passenger fender and grill. There was a cool rooster-tail of mud from the front tire when it rained on our dirt roads. I dream of a replacement at times…
But alas no, I'm over my quota on "cars-the-wife-wants-gone". Thanks for the temptation though!
Why the official ex-daily status? Any pics?
Ex daily because of the amount of time in the year and a half that I've owned it that it's spent not running. I got most of the problems fixed but I am tired of fixing it. Kinda like the VW beetle I had before it, I fixed almost everything that could go wrong and then got tired of fixing it. http://www.fordmuscleforums.com/mercury/499237-19…
I use my "74 Chevrolet Opala daily without too much trouble, I think a sixties car still could do the job just depends on the model, a flat four VW is so easy to maintain but not realy exciting. As Mr TexanIdiot pointed out, the car must have some decent brakes and reasonable handling, other than that it just comes to maintain well your car.
<img src="http://lh4.ggpht.com/_jENN4i7WodY/TF9PzjYeCqI/AAAAAAAACuA/prqc1VqhX6A/img2.jpg">
That is a sweet car!
For daily use I'd go as far back as parts are readily available in the same day. So most likely it would be a late '50's or early '60's Ford or Chevy.
I can still get many parts for the Edsel same day. So lets say '58.
My current DD is a 1992 Ford Taurus L, this sucker is stripped too (which Im almost positive is the reason nothing is broken!).
No A/C, no power windows or locks, had an am/fm radio when i bought it but it is the most reliable car i ever DD… I did consider a 1983 Porsche 944 for a few months, but my dad thankfully talked me out of it after he figured that it would be easier to put a SBC in it than to change the timing belt…
I think you came to the wrong conclusion regarding the 944. You should have bought it and an engine hoist!
Porsche is never an option when you talk to a man like my father who's first DD was a 1962 international scout until 1986, and he didnt get rid of it because of rust, he got rid of it because he flipped it up a tree… His current DD is a 1993 Yamaha V-max, rain show or shine!
Probably something from the mid- to late-'50s, and even then I'd likely limit it to American or German.
80's CRX or MR2 would serve me very well as a DD.
The oldest daily driver I've had was a '74 Swinger, and my current ride with the luxuries of Electronic Fuel Injection and reasonably watertight passenger compartment is an '88 Volvo. Anything from the 80's is good. 70's, okay, but I'm not going back to driving a bathtub that fills with water when it rains. 60's… I think we're reaching the line there. I want a car that has disc brakes with dual circuits, alternator, headrests, three point seatbelts and a collapsible steering column. Volvo 120/140/160 would be perfectly fine. I'm not a safety nazi, but I'd rather not die or get paralyzed in a slow-speed fender bender either.
Show a little patience– they stop filling with water after the floor rusts out. Trust me, I know.
<img src="http://hooniverse.com/blog/wp-content/gallery/getting-to-know-your-falcon/car-on-jackstands-medium.jpg" width=600>
1964, apparently.
Really, anything mid-60s is pretty doable. The tech's old, but still largely continuous to the modern era, meaning you can still get (or swap in) parts.
Once you get to the early 60s and before, things get a little wacky with bizarre dead-end technologies or early versions of engines, transmissions and axles that you can only get from that one crazy guy who you get all your Buick Dynaflite (or whatever) parts from.
Of course, that's assuming you want to stick with a remotely OEM configuration. It's not that hard to take pretty much any post-1930 car down to a body and frame, then rebuild from there.
Good points. Although supplies or even some of the mainstays of the last 3-4 decades are now fading away which scares the crap outta me.
15 years ago I could walk in and buy an alternator or smog pump from Kragens off the shelf for an MG . But the last time I went in to get a set of spark plug wires for a 4 cylinder Japanese car they said "Uh, those "Style" wires are considered obsolete". And an alternator for a Dodge 440 was special order. When the hell did I become a dinosaur?
Kid at parts counter: "A Dodge 440? Uh, what engine size is that?" (Stabs brain)
Sure, you can eventually grab just about anything you need these days off the internet, but sometimes you don't have web access when the waterpump seizes outside nowhereville, population 42. Does this keep me from driving old cars? HELL NO! But a wife with a sense of humor becomes a must…
I'd say 1967 and, appropriately for Wagon Wednesday.
<img src="http://images.classiccars.com/classifieds/134594_10618051_1967_Ford_Country%2BSquire.jpg"end>
Isn't that a beauty… (whistles)
If you're interested, I've got one to sell you…
The Jalopymobile!
For a year-round DD here in
ArcticNorth Dakota I want something from the late 80's or newer. In particular I want multipoint EFI, front discs, overdrive, gas mileage in the high teens or better, an excessively large heater (+ A/C to help the defroster), and an ECU that's easy to get the codes out of (whether the Chrysler key-dance, the GM short-the-two-points, or OBD 2).Most of this is based on my experience DD'ing a '70's car. The '73 Cougar got 14 MPG if I hypermiled, needed to turn 3000 RPM to go 75, and the carburetor would want to be at high idle on cold days and would set up a war between the engine, the brakes, and the available traction while driving on ice in traffic. And nowadays I couldn't bring myself to daily drive a '70's or older car unless I really wouldn't care about losing the car to rust or to a wintertime accident.
I'm going to go with the 60s on this one, but that could change very quickly if I found an earlier car that struck my fancy. My DD is an '01 currently, but I also have a '68 Ford Truck that I use on a fairly consistent basis. I don't drive it every day, but haul all manner of things with it, including taking it 50 miles round-trip to work on occasion. The manual drum brakes all around can be a bit hair raising on the highway, but I can tell you that I'm much more aware of myself and my surroundings when I'm driving that thing. I'm planning on a hunting trip with two buddies this November in it. Its nice to know that some SAE box wrenches, set of points and a can of WD-40 should be enough to keep us out of trouble and take care of any problems that might arise.
My wife's great-great aunt's '64 Buick Special with 19k miles is resting in the body shop of her dad's closed dealership. One day I'd like to buy/inherit that thing and turn it into a nice daily driver.
I've been looking at Oval-window Beetles on thesamba.com.
An additional car isn't in the budget yet (my expenses went up minimally, but my paycheck went up a hell of a lot with the new job and move from upstate NY to northern CA), but nice driver-condition examples can be had under $10k. It is super tempting, to say the least.
My current DD is an '89 Jeep Comanche. It's in need of a tune-up (planned for this weekend) but it runs and drives as well as I could expect for the 1400 of my dollars I laid out.
I drove a '64 Chevy II for 2 months and didn't do a bit of maintenance. I sold it (radiator bone-dry) for $100 more than I paid. Ah, the luck of a young kid.
As I get more experience with doing my own work, and have enough vehicles to leave one down for a few days, my comfort level with older vehicles goes up. I don't see driving something with at least moderately modern brakes/suspension/electrics though.
Interesting, I don't see as much of a debate as I was expecting about what level of crashworthiness/safety goodies is tolerable. I will say that I feel more comfortable in a car with proper three-point belts in front, which usually means 1974 or newer (the earlier separately buckled and non-retracting shoulder belts are better left to bondage fetishists). Setting that issue aside, it does help to pick a car with widespread parts availability. You can still drive a '57 Chevy or a '66 Mustang anywhere and get anything you need at the first Pep Boys/AutoZone/etc. you find. There remains the issue of who does the wrenching if you are unable or disinclined to do it yourself. I gather that mechanics under a certain age have no training or experience working with carburetors, and they don't even know what points are.
My 1983 Starlet can be seen zipping up and down 280 between San Francisco and Palo Alto EVERYDAY. Only 75-80 so you gotta down shift to 3rd on hills but it works fine as daily driver.
Sealed Beam-Check
Carburetor-Check
85mph speedo-Check (Thanks Uncle Ronnie)
Drum Brakes-Check
Solid Rear Axel-Check
Manual Choke-Check
*Note this car replaced my 1994 Supra, so at least i kept it in the Toyota family
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It all depends on how well kept the car is and how much of it is working. My '92 is already feeling a bit dated
Your Sunbeam is pure awesome. Having ridden in it, I can say it's one of the most musical cars I have ever been in. And it took me WAAAY back to the early 70's when an uncle used to let us steer his on dirt roads. I would adopt yours in a heartbeat if you ever get hit by a train.
"…cars from the late eighties back lack both the safety and drivability of more modern iron."
I wouldn't necessarily say that.
<img src="http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4098/4924511041_c8dba90dcb_b.jpg" width="600/">
Admittedly, 1989 was the last year that your Volvo wouldn't have a driver's airbag, but outside of that, I never feel like I'm missing anything in a car that's two years older than I am (foreground), and the 745 (background) has every modern feature I could ask for and some that I wouldn't – heated seats, electric sunroof/locks/windows, alloy wheels, and a height/tilt-adjustable driver's seat.
My requirements are fuel injection, three-point belts, and discs at least in the front; anything beyond that is gravy.
Personally, I daily-drive a 1963 Imperial crown, and would totally rock an even older machine. Everybody's concerns about the performance of drum brakes in normal driving conditions are totally unfounded. Sure the brakes aren't as safe as Dad's Phaeton's, but they perform better than my friend's Suburban with discs up front. It's all about brake pad surface area, and for flatlanders like myself there isn't much worry about overheating the brakes. Parts for machines this old can be a bitch, but a lot of that sort of pain is mitigated if you choose a more common example of the breed.
Plus, girls love old cars, and that's a matter of practicality right there!
http://imgur.com/rhMsv.jpg
First of all, I must state that if upgrade a car too much-new motor, power everything, modern seats, etc.- then you might as well just buy a "retro" car.
That said, although I don't drive mine as a daily driver, the correct answer is a Volvo 122. Comes in coupe, sedan, and wagon body styles. Looks like a shoebox early fifties American car, but is sized better for parking. Its has 12 volts, 1.8 liters (not a tiny engine like some imports), the engines can easily go 500,000 miles, (check the Guiness Book of World records) have 4 speeds plus optional overdrive, front disc brakes. Upgrade with an alternator, Bilstein shocks, and an electric ignition. You can even get fuel injection from an early 1970's Volvo. The car has the old car cues- low back seats, all chrome bumpers, horn ring, key in the dashboard to make it stand out from moderns. Parts are not quite as comprehensive as Mercedes factory classic program, but they are far cheaper as well! Remember, buy the best you can afford, it will be cheaper in the long run.
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